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	<title>Comments on: New MacArthur Study: Must Read for Educators</title>
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	<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/</link>
	<description>Learning with the Read/Write Web</description>
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		<title>By: Mary Hall</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-62010</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary Hall</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 04:07:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-62010</guid>
		<description>I was taken with your comment that &quot;Their learning is “knowmadic”, as is most learning in the real world outside of school. We’re not linear, test assessed learners once we leave the system, are we?&quot;

This echoes the theme of a chapter I have just had published called &quot;getting to know the feral learner&quot;.   
(see http://books.google.co.nz/books?id=2qH_61xZW20C&amp;pg=PA109&amp;dq=%22learning+landscape%22&amp;source=gbs_toc_r&amp;cad=0_0#PPA110,M1).

I think this is a really important concept in education for the 21st century - that we don&#039;t (and shouldn&#039;t try to)control what students learn. We&#039;re used to relating to learners as if they were dogs that can be trained to do what we want, when we want. We need to think about it differently (&quot;herding cats&quot; comes to mind).  

Changing that mindset - trying to work as a tracker or guide rather than a trainer suggests quite a different teaching style, and quite a different notion of school.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was taken with your comment that &#8220;Their learning is “knowmadic”, as is most learning in the real world outside of school. We’re not linear, test assessed learners once we leave the system, are we?&#8221;</p>
<p>This echoes the theme of a chapter I have just had published called &#8220;getting to know the feral learner&#8221;.<br />
(see <a href="http://books.google.co.nz/books?id=2qH_61xZW20C&#038;pg=PA109&#038;dq=%22learning+landscape%22&#038;source=gbs_toc_r&#038;cad=0_0#PPA110,M1" rel="nofollow">http://books.google.co.nz/books?id=2qH_61xZW20C&#038;pg=PA109&#038;dq=%22learning+landscape%22&#038;source=gbs_toc_r&#038;cad=0_0#PPA110,M1</a>).</p>
<p>I think this is a really important concept in education for the 21st century &#8211; that we don&#8217;t (and shouldn&#8217;t try to)control what students learn. We&#8217;re used to relating to learners as if they were dogs that can be trained to do what we want, when we want. We need to think about it differently (&#8220;herding cats&#8221; comes to mind).  </p>
<p>Changing that mindset &#8211; trying to work as a tracker or guide rather than a trainer suggests quite a different teaching style, and quite a different notion of school.</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Simones</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61866</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Simones</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 16:01:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61866</guid>
		<description>In response to Richardson’s ideal classroom, I’m interested in hearing about the technological background you would want teachers to possess, and how the use of technology would be incorporated into lessons.  

You mentioned a more real-world, application based curriculum, which I agree with.  However, do you see the need to also include time for students to work independently of technology?  A recent Read Write Web article -  http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/education_20_never_memorize_again.php - sparked an important debate about whether or not students should be dependent on the web in place of traditional memorization.  I believe that the most successful students and people are those that are able to use resources in the most efficient manner, but also those able to gauge when it is appropriate to use technology, and when they would benefit more from coming to their own conclusions.  

It seems we’ve reached the general consensus that there is not enough technology being incorporated in the classroom.  But along with the incorporation of more technology, comes the responsibility of teaching its most effective and appropriate use.  Can this be taught?

Peter Simones
http://www.Cramster.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In response to Richardson’s ideal classroom, I’m interested in hearing about the technological background you would want teachers to possess, and how the use of technology would be incorporated into lessons.  </p>
<p>You mentioned a more real-world, application based curriculum, which I agree with.  However, do you see the need to also include time for students to work independently of technology?  A recent Read Write Web article &#8211;  <a href="http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/education_20_never_memorize_again.php" rel="nofollow">http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/education_20_never_memorize_again.php</a> &#8211; sparked an important debate about whether or not students should be dependent on the web in place of traditional memorization.  I believe that the most successful students and people are those that are able to use resources in the most efficient manner, but also those able to gauge when it is appropriate to use technology, and when they would benefit more from coming to their own conclusions.  </p>
<p>It seems we’ve reached the general consensus that there is not enough technology being incorporated in the classroom.  But along with the incorporation of more technology, comes the responsibility of teaching its most effective and appropriate use.  Can this be taught?</p>
<p>Peter Simones<br />
<a href="http://www.Cramster.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.Cramster.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: Deborah</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61864</link>
		<dc:creator>Deborah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Dec 2008 14:44:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61864</guid>
		<description>Teachers by nature are not fighters; if they are Mavericks the system can be very hard on them.  So hats off to youth because many students are engaging in this manner outside of the educational system and some are clever enough to hack the blocks put in place by IT departments. These hackers probably will not end up as educators.  We want students to question and teachers to follow!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Teachers by nature are not fighters; if they are Mavericks the system can be very hard on them.  So hats off to youth because many students are engaging in this manner outside of the educational system and some are clever enough to hack the blocks put in place by IT departments. These hackers probably will not end up as educators.  We want students to question and teachers to follow!</p>
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		<title>By: Amazing Link &#124; weBLOG</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61831</link>
		<dc:creator>Amazing Link &#124; weBLOG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 21:19:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61831</guid>
		<description>[...] Here is the link to Will&#8217;s site, where in turn you will find the link to the McArthur Study. http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/ Let&#8217;s talk about this at our next meeting! anne   Create a free edublog to get your own [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Here is the link to Will&#8217;s site, where in turn you will find the link to the McArthur Study. <a href="http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/ Let&#8217;s" rel="nofollow">http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/ Let&#8217;s</a> talk about this at our next meeting! anne   Create a free edublog to get your own [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Born Digital v. grown up digital &#171; Re - Aloud</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61829</link>
		<dc:creator>Born Digital v. grown up digital &#171; Re - Aloud</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 02 Dec 2008 19:08:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61829</guid>
		<description>[...] to do on a much smaller scale.  I have been awaiting their findings, and have been interested in response to their findings. Since I have read much of what the researchers have written there were no [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] to do on a much smaller scale.  I have been awaiting their findings, and have been interested in response to their findings. Since I have read much of what the researchers have written there were no [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rich</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61754</link>
		<dc:creator>Rich</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 30 Nov 2008 00:12:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61754</guid>
		<description>I agree that we need to open the way we teach our students to include the use of technology in the classroom and allow peer-to-peer learning through such technologies.  I have seen an increase in effort recently by allwoing more access to the inernet during class.  Students immediately search topics in which they are struggling and begin to explain in &quot;kid terms&quot; the way physical systems interact.  It has been a welcome addition to my classroom.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree that we need to open the way we teach our students to include the use of technology in the classroom and allow peer-to-peer learning through such technologies.  I have seen an increase in effort recently by allwoing more access to the inernet during class.  Students immediately search topics in which they are struggling and begin to explain in &#8220;kid terms&#8221; the way physical systems interact.  It has been a welcome addition to my classroom.</p>
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		<title>By: Study Finds Social Networking Good For Teens &#124; next2friendsblog.com</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61642</link>
		<dc:creator>Study Finds Social Networking Good For Teens &#124; next2friendsblog.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Nov 2008 00:33:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61642</guid>
		<description>[...] In a three year study of 800 teens over 5000 hours of observation, The Digital Youth Project found that, contrary to what many parents feel, usage of social networking and social media is actually good for kids. Yet another positive mark for the future of social media.  Among the skills it hones are social and technical navigation.  Will Richardson highlights some of the findings in his excellent blog post: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] In a three year study of 800 teens over 5000 hours of observation, The Digital Youth Project found that, contrary to what many parents feel, usage of social networking and social media is actually good for kids. Yet another positive mark for the future of social media.  Among the skills it hones are social and technical navigation.  Will Richardson highlights some of the findings in his excellent blog post: [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Eric Grant</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61620</link>
		<dc:creator>Eric Grant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 18:02:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61620</guid>
		<description>Will, Glenn -

The sad part is that schools such as the one you describe do exist, but they stay on the fringes and only a few kids get to experience them. Schools like High Tech High, Science Leadership Academy, and New Tech Foundation schools, fit your vision of project-based experiential environments with some element of portfolio- and peer-based assessment. NTF, in particular, has a great model of blended subjects, focus on 21st century skills, eportfolios, and a touch of jigsaw.

I don&#039;t believe in one-size-fits-all, but these schools just seem to fit the needs of today&#039;s learners far better than your average comprehensive high school, and if someone told me to pick one model, that would be it. Add a bit of local and global community involvement and some eco principles and we&#039;d have a connected, thin-wall, relevant, authentic, and sustainable design.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will, Glenn -</p>
<p>The sad part is that schools such as the one you describe do exist, but they stay on the fringes and only a few kids get to experience them. Schools like High Tech High, Science Leadership Academy, and New Tech Foundation schools, fit your vision of project-based experiential environments with some element of portfolio- and peer-based assessment. NTF, in particular, has a great model of blended subjects, focus on 21st century skills, eportfolios, and a touch of jigsaw.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t believe in one-size-fits-all, but these schools just seem to fit the needs of today&#8217;s learners far better than your average comprehensive high school, and if someone told me to pick one model, that would be it. Add a bit of local and global community involvement and some eco principles and we&#8217;d have a connected, thin-wall, relevant, authentic, and sustainable design.</p>
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		<title>By: Will Richardson</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61618</link>
		<dc:creator>Will Richardson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 17:21:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61618</guid>
		<description>Glenn...thanks for stepping out to comment here. Really appreciate it. A vision of a school that I could build is hard to wrap my brain around, but it would certainly include a physical space with lots of face to face time with peers and caring, knowledgeable teachers. But the curriculum would be project based, real world application based, and the assessments would not be paper and pencil but performance and peer guided. 

All learning is social, I&#039;m convinced of that. And good physical space classrooms are effective networks that utilize the collective brains and experiences of everyone in the room. One of our goals now has to be to teach our students to do that on their own. So, in my ideal school, the classes truly have &quot;thin walls&quot; as Clarence Fisher calls them. They get outside the physical space all the time and connect to the experts and fellow passionate learners about all sorts of topics, some teacher chosen, others student selected, and they build things, create and publish them collaboratively. 

I&#039;m sure that many kids still prefer face to face, and I&#039;m not advocating we get rid of that by any means. But we can take much of what we do and expand upon it in ways that teach the literacies that kids will need to have to be successful. Hope that clarifies it a bit...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Glenn&#8230;thanks for stepping out to comment here. Really appreciate it. A vision of a school that I could build is hard to wrap my brain around, but it would certainly include a physical space with lots of face to face time with peers and caring, knowledgeable teachers. But the curriculum would be project based, real world application based, and the assessments would not be paper and pencil but performance and peer guided. </p>
<p>All learning is social, I&#8217;m convinced of that. And good physical space classrooms are effective networks that utilize the collective brains and experiences of everyone in the room. One of our goals now has to be to teach our students to do that on their own. So, in my ideal school, the classes truly have &#8220;thin walls&#8221; as Clarence Fisher calls them. They get outside the physical space all the time and connect to the experts and fellow passionate learners about all sorts of topics, some teacher chosen, others student selected, and they build things, create and publish them collaboratively. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure that many kids still prefer face to face, and I&#8217;m not advocating we get rid of that by any means. But we can take much of what we do and expand upon it in ways that teach the literacies that kids will need to have to be successful. Hope that clarifies it a bit&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Glenn</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61596</link>
		<dc:creator>Glenn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 01:38:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61596</guid>
		<description>Will, 
I am a member of the NJPLP cohort.  I am slowly developing web 2.0 skills and growing more and more eager to learn.

I have read through your post and most of the responses.  After reading all of the above, I have a grasp of what you truly believe in.  However, I am not clear as to what public schools look like if we were able to break down all the barriers.  Please describe for me what a 21st school would look like if you could build your own school exactly as you see it.  Is there a physical structure, is there a curriculum. Do students enroll in classes? Is there work graded by teachers or peers... or not at all. 

As an educator of twenty five years, questioning everything I&#039;ve known, trying to work my way out of the box, I need some clarity.  Can students learn everything they need to know through networking? Are there subjects that are still better taught in a traditional classroom setting? Are there &quot;digital natives&quot; out there who still prefer and learn algebra much better when they are face to face with a teacher?
Will, I have sipped the cool aid and am ready to drink it up.  I just need a little less philosophical picture of your vision of the school you want your children attending.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Will,<br />
I am a member of the NJPLP cohort.  I am slowly developing web 2.0 skills and growing more and more eager to learn.</p>
<p>I have read through your post and most of the responses.  After reading all of the above, I have a grasp of what you truly believe in.  However, I am not clear as to what public schools look like if we were able to break down all the barriers.  Please describe for me what a 21st school would look like if you could build your own school exactly as you see it.  Is there a physical structure, is there a curriculum. Do students enroll in classes? Is there work graded by teachers or peers&#8230; or not at all. </p>
<p>As an educator of twenty five years, questioning everything I&#8217;ve known, trying to work my way out of the box, I need some clarity.  Can students learn everything they need to know through networking? Are there subjects that are still better taught in a traditional classroom setting? Are there &#8220;digital natives&#8221; out there who still prefer and learn algebra much better when they are face to face with a teacher?<br />
Will, I have sipped the cool aid and am ready to drink it up.  I just need a little less philosophical picture of your vision of the school you want your children attending.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Kalis</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61595</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Kalis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 25 Nov 2008 01:12:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61595</guid>
		<description>Two areas of the paper are of particular concern to me.  First: &quot;Social and recreational online activities are jumping-off points for experimenting with digital media creation and self-expression. Rather than seeing socializing and play as hostile to learning, educational programs could be positioned to step in and support moments when youth are motivated to move from friendship-driven to more interest-driven forms of new media use. This requires a cultural shift and a certain openness to experimentation and social exploration that is generally not characteristic of educational institutions...&quot; (p. 35).

I believe that as educational leaders we must begin to actively speak out against the restrictions that many of us face when trying to incorporate Web 2.0 tools in our classrooms.  We need to promote research in this area so that we are armed with the data to support our positions.

Second: &quot;When kids lack access to the Internet at home, and public libraries and schools block sites that are central to their social communication, youth are doubly handicapped in their efforts to participate in common culture and sociability&quot; (p. 36).

Having worked in an urban district, I&#039;ve seen first-hand the handicap that may students face.  Beyond the read-write web and social aspects, many of these students lack the technology savy to use the web, such as researching and applying to college, that students from other socioeconomic levels have mastered.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Two areas of the paper are of particular concern to me.  First: &#8220;Social and recreational online activities are jumping-off points for experimenting with digital media creation and self-expression. Rather than seeing socializing and play as hostile to learning, educational programs could be positioned to step in and support moments when youth are motivated to move from friendship-driven to more interest-driven forms of new media use. This requires a cultural shift and a certain openness to experimentation and social exploration that is generally not characteristic of educational institutions&#8230;&#8221; (p. 35).</p>
<p>I believe that as educational leaders we must begin to actively speak out against the restrictions that many of us face when trying to incorporate Web 2.0 tools in our classrooms.  We need to promote research in this area so that we are armed with the data to support our positions.</p>
<p>Second: &#8220;When kids lack access to the Internet at home, and public libraries and schools block sites that are central to their social communication, youth are doubly handicapped in their efforts to participate in common culture and sociability&#8221; (p. 36).</p>
<p>Having worked in an urban district, I&#8217;ve seen first-hand the handicap that may students face.  Beyond the read-write web and social aspects, many of these students lack the technology savy to use the web, such as researching and applying to college, that students from other socioeconomic levels have mastered.</p>
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		<title>By: Blogging Professional Development Pre-requisite: Must be willing to travel the world and back again in your jammies &#171; LifelongLearner Rhonda&#8217;s Weblog</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61550</link>
		<dc:creator>Blogging Professional Development Pre-requisite: Must be willing to travel the world and back again in your jammies &#171; LifelongLearner Rhonda&#8217;s Weblog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 24 Nov 2008 00:24:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61550</guid>
		<description>[...] Librarian Bloggers Worldwide site . I get hyped up by reading blogs like Will Richardson&#8217;s New MacArthur Study: Must Read for Educators [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Librarian Bloggers Worldwide site . I get hyped up by reading blogs like Will Richardson&#8217;s New MacArthur Study: Must Read for Educators [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Gary S. Stager</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61525</link>
		<dc:creator>Gary S. Stager</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 23 Nov 2008 00:10:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61525</guid>
		<description>I concur with my esteemed colleague from across the aisle, Mr. Richardson. &quot;Experience and Education&quot; is a great place to start. You may be able to Google an online copy.

Another astounding book from that era is http://tinyurl.com/5lnu9o

A modern example of scalable successful progressive education may be found in this book: http://tinyurl.com/6lfvd5

A library of books I recommend may be found here: http://constructivistconsortium.org/books/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I concur with my esteemed colleague from across the aisle, Mr. Richardson. &#8220;Experience and Education&#8221; is a great place to start. You may be able to Google an online copy.</p>
<p>Another astounding book from that era is <a href="http://tinyurl.com/5lnu9o" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/5lnu9o</a></p>
<p>A modern example of scalable successful progressive education may be found in this book: <a href="http://tinyurl.com/6lfvd5" rel="nofollow">http://tinyurl.com/6lfvd5</a></p>
<p>A library of books I recommend may be found here: <a href="http://constructivistconsortium.org/books/" rel="nofollow">http://constructivistconsortium.org/books/</a></p>
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		<title>By: Will Richardson</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61513</link>
		<dc:creator>Will Richardson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 22:04:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61513</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m sure Gary will have a whole list. I&#039;d recommend &quot;Experience and Education&quot; however, which is a pretty powerful read.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m sure Gary will have a whole list. I&#8217;d recommend &#8220;Experience and Education&#8221; however, which is a pretty powerful read.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Alley</title>
		<link>http://weblogg-ed.com/2008/new-macarthur-study-must-read-for-educators/comment-page-1/#comment-61511</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Alley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 22 Nov 2008 22:02:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://weblogg-ed.com/?p=2948#comment-61511</guid>
		<description>Gary, Will, or anyone else,

Might one of you recommend which one of Dewey&#039;s books (or an article of articles about Dewey&#039;s ideas) to read for those of us interested in discovering these parallels first hand?

Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gary, Will, or anyone else,</p>
<p>Might one of you recommend which one of Dewey&#8217;s books (or an article of articles about Dewey&#8217;s ideas) to read for those of us interested in discovering these parallels first hand?</p>
<p>Thanks!</p>
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